Source: www.rucriminal.com
rucriminal.com continues the publication of the hearing materials in the US court where the claim was examined - the chairman of the board of directors of BTA Bank Kenes Rakishev and the city of Almaty to the former owner of the bank Mukhtar Ablyazov, the former head of the capital of Kazakhstan Viktor Khrapunov and his son Ilyas Khrapunov, to whom plaintiffs have been charged with laundering allegedly stolen money in Kazakhstan. At the disposal of Rucriminal.com was a transcript of the interrogation of Kenes Rakishev, which reveals many of his intimate secrets. In the second publication, readers will be able to see how Rakishev with great reluctance acknowledges the fact of hacking his personal mail, which he used from 2004 to 2014. Why does it reluctantly? In fact, in this way, Rakishev confirmed the authenticity of his correspondence with "pimple No. 1" Peter Listerman, who had earlier disappeared into the network. On it, Kenes "orders" girls, including minors.
Analysis of correspondence shows that the cooperation began in 2007, when the assistant "Ochkarika" (Listerman's nickname) sent Rakishev photos of two girls with comments that one of them is designed for Kenes himself, the second "for the elder." One of them is the 18-year-old Dasha Konovalova, who today is the top model and only 210,000 subscribers in the Instagram, the other is Alina Garayeva.
In 2012, the situation takes an interesting turn. July 11 Listerman sends Rakishev letter about "Elenu S.", which contains only a video with 15-year-old Elena Selezneva. On the record the girl defiles and it seems, her age is clearly heard. Rakishev's minority does not bother, he immediately answers Listerman: "Super! Skolko? ".
Instead of the answer, the oligarch gets another video with 21-year-old Matilda Romanova and 17-year-old Alina Marasik, another minor girl. Both unassuming young men Kenes Rakishev calls "super variants".
Next time Листерман writes in July, 2013, sending video of certain model which dreams to act in film from James Kemerona and carries a nickname "Avatar". Rakishev, without thinking for a long time, answers: "Let's go to Kazakhstan!"
Listerman continues to send letters with photos of girls whom he calls "translators" and in 2014. Obviously, the seller and the customer have some kind of additional communication channel, exchanging by mail only photos and video.
Q. How much did you invest in Sat &Co.'s prior to Sat & Co.'s IPO?
A. As I have told you before, in 2004, I became part of the management of the company and owing to these credit lines, plus the money that my partners and myself owed - not owed, had, it's approximately with all together with credit lines, it's from 200 to $300 million.
Q. Mr. Rakishev, as chairman of the board of BTA Bank, can you describe your responsibilities?
MR. SCHWARTZ: Today.
A. Though the bank, as of today, the bank does not have the license for banking, but it has build based on corporate principles as a classic bank. It has management board and board of directors, I am chairman of the board of directors and I also have members of the board and all strategic issues were discussed at our board meetings and day-to-day activities are responsibility of the management board.
Q. How many employees does BTA Bank have?
A. As of today I would say approximately 150, but that's only in Almaty.
Q. Does BTA have an office in Almaty?
A. Yes, they had offices in Almaty.
Q. How many offices does BTA have in Almaty?
A. One.
Q. Does BTA have any other offices besides the one office it has in Almaty?
A. Yes, BTA Bank has some daughter companies, banks with licenses in different countries.
Q. Does BTA have any other offices in Kazakhstan besides the office it has in Almaty?
A. As far as I know, no.
MR. SCHWARTZ: I just want to remind everyone, the witness is not here as a representative of BTA Bank. You had seven hours with a Rule 30(b)(6) witness of BTA Bank, so these sort of general questions about the structure of the bank, I think, are not properly put to him.
Q. Mr. Rakishev, do you own the daughter companies?
A. The bank is.
Q. So
A. I own the bank and the bank owns those companies, those banks, that's the way it is.
Q. In which countries does BTA have subsidiaries?
A. Belarus, Kyrgyzstan, Ukraine, Belarus , B-E-L-A-R-U-S, again, this information can be easily found in Open Sources.
Q. Mr. Rakishev, you mentioned a board of directors and a management board, those are two different boards, correct?
A. Yes.
Q. And you mentioned that BTA does not have a banking license, right?
A. BTA does not have banking license in Kazakhstan.
Q. Does BTA Bank operate as a lending bank in Kazakhstan?
A. No, it's like a management company, it's like a company that manages assets, simple assets, problematic assets.
Q. Have you read the amended cross claims in this case?
A. No.
Q. Do you have any understanding what this case is about?
A. I would say that I have strategic understanding of it as chairman of the board and the lawyers are in charge of the rest.
Q. Who is Nurlan Nurgabylov?
A. This person is vice-chair of the board of directors - no, my bad - he is vice-chair of the - CEO of the board, vice-CEO of the board and member of the board - member of the management board and vice-CEO of the board of directors, deputy CEO and member of management board.
Q. Is Mr. Nurgabylov responsible for recovering assets that BTA alleges was taken from it by Mukhtar Ablyazov?
A. He is the person who is in charge of recovering assets.
Q. Does Mr. Nurgabylov report to you?
A. Well, he reports to the chair of the board or CEO, not me, but chairman of the board, chairman of the board of directors and we have CEO and he is the vice-CEO and member of management board. For your question, he is reporting to the CEO of the management board.
Q. You testified a moment ago that Mr. Nurgabylov is the person who was in charge of recovering assets?
A. Correct.
Q. What assets are you referring to?
A. I believe that we are familiar with the fact that we have court proceedings in various countries and based on the court decisions in different countries, what we do, we work to recover our assets and bring them back. It's a big list, I would say.
Q. What court proceedings are you referring to?
A. Well, we have court proceedings with former owners of BTA Bank and former managers of the BTA Bank in various countries of the world.
Q. And Mr. Nurgabylov is in charge of BTA's efforts to recover assets from these individuals?
A. Yes, yes.
Q. Did you discuss Mr. Nurgabylov's work with him?
A. What do you mean by his work?
Q. For example, does Mr. Nurgabylov provide you with reports concerning the progress of BTA's efforts to recover assets from these individuals?
A. Yes, he does report. He reports to us, to all the members of the board of directors.
Q. How often does he make those reports?
A. It depends on the issue, but, in general, we have -- we discuss it once or twice a month with the board of directors.
Q. Outside of these once or twice a month meetings with the board of directors, do you ever discuss BTA's efforts to recover assets from these individuals with Mr. Nurgabylov?
A. Yes, occasionally, he reports to us, board of directors, he reports to us the progress of the issues.
Q. Do you give Mr. Nurgabylov instructions with respect to BTA's efforts to recover assets from these individuals?
A. The board of directors, the entire board of directors as a body gives instructions based on the resolutions adopted by the board of directors.
Q. Mr. Rakishev, as chairman of the board of directors at BTA Bank, do you supervise BTA's law firms that are pursuing asset recovery on BTA's behalf?
MR. SCHWARTZ: Objection.
A. As I have already mentioned before, we have a lot of different court proceedings in various countries and the management board is actually entitled or that's the job that they have, to work with the law firms on each issue that is at hand.
Q. Mr. Rakishev, without telling me the substance of any communications, do you communicate with BTA's outside law firms about its asset recovery efforts?
MR. SCHWARTZ: Objection. This is a yes or no question.
A. For this, we have Mr. Nurgabylov, who reports to his board at the beginning and then he reports to the board of directors.
Q. Right, but what I'm asking is whether you, Mr. Rakishev, communicate with the law firms that are pursuing asset recovery on BTA's behalf and, again, don't tell me what you've talked about with the lawyers, it's just a yes or no question, whether you communicate with BTA's outside lawyers? MR. SCHWARTZ: Objection.
A. I am not sure that I understand your question. Do you mean whether I am familiar with these law firms or I give them instructions? Those are different things. If the question is whether I am familiar or no or ever met with any of those people, the answer is yes, but if the question is whether I provide any instructions to them, the answer is no.
Q. Who provides instructions to BTA's lawyers?
A. The management.
Q. Does management get its instructions from you?
MR. SCHWARTZ: Objection.
A. With respect to day-to-day activities, they do not receive any instructions from us. Only with respect to strategic issues.
Q. Again, I don't want to know what the issues are or what the communications were, but on strategic issues, do you give instructions to the board that are then passed on to -- excuse me. Do you give instructions to BTA's management that are then forwarded to BTA's lawyers?
MR. SCHWARTZ: Objection.
A. It's not me that gives instructions, it's the board of directors that does it.
Q. How many members are there on the board of directors?
A. As of today, there are five members.
MS. MICHAELSON: I would ask the witness not use his cell phone during the deposition.
THE WITNESS: Sorry.
Q. Do you know that Mr. Nurgabylov was deposed in this case?
A. Yes, I heard about that.
Q. Did you discuss Mr. Nurgabylov's deposition with him before he testified?
A. He just told me about that, but since it' s confidential, he cannot share any details with me.
Q. Did he tell you before he came to New York to be deposed that he was coming to New York to be deposed?
A. He reported to the board of directors that he was going to be deposed.
Q. You mentioned a moment ago that – withdrawn. Did Mr. Nurgabylov talk to you about his deposition after his deposition?
A. He shared with the board of directors , just in general meaning of it because he cannot do that due to the confidentiality clause.
Q. Mr. Rakishev, did you read Mr. Nurgabylov's deposition transcript?
A. No.
Q. Did you hire Mr. Nurgabylov to work at BTA Bank?
A. He worked there before that.
Q. Did you - is your answer no, you did not?
A. He was employed by the BTA Bank before I came to the bank.
Q. Did you meet with Mr. Nurgabylov in December of 2013?
A. No, later than that.
Q. When did you first meet Mr. Nurgabylov?
A. I don't remember the date for sure.
Q. Did you know Mr. Nurgabylov before you agreed to buy half of BTA Bank in December of 2013?
A. No.
Q. So you met Mr. Nurgabylov for the first time after you agreed to invest in BTA Bank, is that right?
A. Actually, I met him after I had made my investment, after I started to work on the board of directors and that's when I met him, as one of the employees of the bank.
Q. At the time when you met him for the first time, was Mr. Nurgabylov in charge of BTA's asset recovery efforts?
A. As far as I remember, he had a different position with the bank.
Q. What was his position at the bank at the time?
A. I'm not sure, but I believe he was an advisor to the chairman of the board.
Q. Do you remember when he was placed in charge of BTA's recovery efforts?
A. I can't tell you for sure, I don't remember.
Q. Was it your decision to make Mr. Nurgabylov in charge of BTA's asset recovery efforts?
A. As per our rules, I cannot make a decision myself. The board of directors can make decisions.
Q. Did you recommend to the board of directors that they make Mr. Nurgabylov head of BTA's asset recovery efforts?
A. Usually, what happens, the management board nominates a person and what we do, we confirm this person.
Q. Did the management board recommend Mr. Nurgabylov to become the head of BTA's asset recovery efforts?
A. Yes.
Q. Who on the management board communicated that recommendation to you?
A. HR people.
Q. Do you remember exactly whom?
A. No, I don't recall because the way it works, it's like a paper, it's presented to the board of directors, then we review that and then we make a decision and confirm. Chairman of the management board makes recommendation. We do not use CEO as a title, but he is chairman of the board of managers.
Q. Did the chairman of the board of managers recommend to you that Mr. Nurgabylov be placed in charge of BTA's asset recovery assets?
MR. SCHWARTZ: Objection.
A. Once again, I want to reiterate, not to me, but to the board of directors.
Q. What did the chairman of BTA's board of managers say to BTA's board of directors when he recommended Mr. Nurgabylov to become head of BTA's asset recovery effort?
A. He didn't say anything, he just brought a piece of paper and the board of directors was supposed to discuss it.
Q. Did the board of directors discuss that recommendation?
A. Yes, and made the resolution to appoint.
Q. Did the board of directors consider any other candidates for that position?
A. Well, mainly we actually reviewed different nominees or different candidates.
Q. Do you remember how many other candidates you considered for this position?
A. I can't tell you for sure how many, but I believe there were two or three candidates.
Q. Do you remember why the board of directors selected Mr. Nurgabylov for this position?
MR. SCHWARTZ: Objection.
A. Well, once again, the documents were brought for the consideration of the board of directors and since the management board had made this recommendation, we decided to support it.
Q. Was Mr. Nurgabylov recommended to the board of directors by anyone from Kazakhstan's Ministry of Justice?
MR.SCHWARTZ: Objection.
A. Well, actually, Minister of Justice does not have a right to recommend anybody to commercial structures or commercial entities.
Q. So is it your testimony that no, no one from the Ministry of Justice recommended Mr. Nurgabylov for this position?
MR.SCHWARTZ: Objection.
A. Let me reiterate, there is no procedural - there is no procedural structure or element that Minister of Justice can recommend someone to commercial entities.
Q. I guess what I'm asking is, was there ever an informal recommendation, regardless of whether there are procedures that are set out for this sort of thing, was there ever an informal recommendation from anyone the at the Ministry of Justice to recommend Mr. Nurgabylov for the job of heading BTA's asset recovery efforts?
MR. SCHWARTZ: Objection.
A. Could you please clarify what you mean and what do you mean, informal? Maybe you can clarify for me.
Q. For example, are you aware of anyone at the Ministry of Justice picking up the phone or sending an email recommending Mr. Nurgabylov for this job or saying Mr. Nurgabylov would be a good candidate for this job?
MR. SCHWARTZ: Objection.
A. I do not know anything - I do not have this information.
Q. Mr. Rakishev, do you own - the BTA stock that you own, do you own that in your personal capacity?
A. Yes.
Q. Do you have a financial interest in any of BTA's asset recovery efforts?
MR. SCHWARTZ: Objection.
A. I do not understand the question.
Q. It's fair to say that the more money BTA recovers from these individuals that BTA alleges stole money from BTA, the better BTA is, right?
MR. SCHWARTZ: Objection.
A. So you mean the better it will be for the BTA Bank, is that your question?
MR. SCHWARTZ: He is asking if it's good to have money.
A. Yes.
Q. And you own BTA Bank, right?
A. Yes.
Q. So the more money BTA Bank has, is better for you, right?
A. Well, it sounds logical.
Q- I'm asking something slightly different. Do you have an agreement with BTA Bank whereby you are entitled to 100 percent and or a portion of any recovery that BTA recovers from any of the individuals whom it alleges stole money from it?
MR. SCHWARTZ: Objection.
A. There are no agreements – there are no such agreements and I do not see any sense in having such agreements.
Q. Mr. Rakishev, do you know who Marat Bekatayev is - Mr. Rakishev, do you know who Marat Bekatayev is?
A. Yes.
Q. Who is Marat Bekatayev?
A. It's Minister of Justice of the Republic of Kazakhstan.
MR. SCHWARTZ: If you are changing topics, can we just take a break?
THE VIDEOGRAPHER: We are now off the record. The time is 11:25 a.m.
(Recess.)
THE VIDEOGRAPHER: We are now on the record. The time is 11:39 a.m.
This begins DVD No. 2.
Q. Mr. Rakishev, I just want to go back and I think I understand your answer, but I just want to make sure the record is clear. Do you remember before we broke, I asked you whether you had an agreement where you might receive a certain percentage of any recovery that BTA makes against the individuals it alleges stole money from it?
A. No.
Q. You don't remember my asking that or there is no such agreement?
A. Well, I mean, the very agreement that you are describing, meaning, that if the assets are recovered or if the money is recovered and with the bank and if I get anything of it, no there, is no such an agreement. You meant percentages in your question, right?
Q. My question did refer to percentages.
A. So in this -- the answer is no.
Q. Is there an agreement where you, Mr. Rakishev, are entitled to the full amount of any assets that BTA recovers?
MR. SCHWARTZ: Objection.
A. I'm not sure I understand the question. I am interested in having all the assets recovered and returned to the bank.
Q. I think this is maybe just we are two ships passing here, so let me ask maybe in a more direct way. Is it the case that any assets that BTA recovers go back to BTA and not to you personally, right?
MR. SCHWARTZ: Objection.
A. Everything that is returned is returned to the bank where I am the majority shareholder.
Q. Thank you. Mr. Rakishev, has BTA Bank ever been the victim of email hacking?
MR. SCHWARTZ: Objection.
A. I'm not sure I can answer this question. I really do not understand what it is about. Maybe hackers would be able to answer this question better than I can or the people who actually ordered hacking.
Q. At this point, I'm not asking you any details about the hacking. It's just a simple question, whether BTA's emails have ever been hacked, if you know?
A. I'm not sure I can answer this question because I am not an expert in IT issues.
Q. Have your personal emails ever been hacked?
A. I believe I can say yes, but with respect to my personal email, I can't, and I cannot affirm that it was hacked. I just lost access to my email, personal email account in 2004 - 2014.
Q. Have the contents of your emails ever appeared in places outside of your control?
MR. SCHWARTZ: Objection.
A. May I clarify? You are asking this question with respect to this specific case because in my personal emails, there was nothing relevant for this case.
Q. And that may be. I'm really asking something more broad at this point. Have your personal emails ever been stolen?
A. I want to reiterate one more time, since 2014, I have not had access to my personal, not corporate, my personal email account.
Q. Mr. Rakishev, have you ever heard of the website Kazaword?
A. Yes, I heard about it.
Q. Are you aware that BTA Bank has taken the position in this case that Ilyas Khrapunov is responsible for hacking emails that have appeared on the Kazaword website?
MR. SCHWARTZ: Objection.
A. Actually, you are responding yourself to your own question.
Q. Mr. Rakishev, my question is whether before you sat down here today, you knew that lawyers for the bank of which you are the chairman of the board have taken the position in a U.S. Federal Court that Ilyas Khrapunov is responsible for stealing emails that have appeared on the Kazaword website?
MR. SCHWARTZ: Objection.
A. Actually, the different lawyers have different theories with respect to that and I believe that the court will be able to answer this question.
Q. Let me say that I don't want to know what your lawyers have told you privately. I'm not interested in that, so I want to caution you not to go down that road. Do you, Mr. Rakishev, believe that Mr. Khrapunov is responsible for hacking emails that have appeared on the Kazaword website?
MR. SCHWARTZ: Objection. What does it matter what he believes about this?
MR. CURLEY: If he can just answer the question I asked three minutes ago, we can get through this.
A. If I may, counselor, can I ask a question? How relevant is this question to the proceedings that we have or to these depositions?
Q. Let me come at it a different way. Have you ever discussed email hacking with Mr. Nurgabylov?
MR. SCHWARTZ: Objection.
A. With many different people, I discussed the fact that I did not have access to my personal email account, it happened in 2014 and I can affirm that in my own email account, there were never, ever emails that were sent to me or by me, emails concerning this specific case. So that's why, if we are going to discuss my personal email account, I should say that it doesn't have anything to do with this specific issue at hand.
Q. So you are saying that your personal email account contains emails that you didn't send, is that right?
MR. SCHWARTZ: No.
A. No, I didn't say that. What I said was that since 2014, I have not had access to my personal email account.
Q. Did Mr. Nurgabylov discuss the Kazaword website with you?
A. There are a lot of people in Kazakhstan that discuss this website, it's pretty famous and I cannot tell you specifically who this site was discussed with, but I know that a great number of people discuss this website.
Q. Mr. Rakishev, are you aware of any evidence that Mr. Ilyas Khrapunov is responsible for hacking emails that appeared on a Kazaword website?
A. I would like to reiterate if it had any slight relevance to the specific case that we are discussing today, I'm ready to discuss it with you.
Q. Mr. Rakishev, are you aware of any evidence that Mr. Ilyas Khrapunov is responsible for hacking emails that appeared on the Kazaword website?
A. It's not my duty to look for evidence, to look for evidence pertaining to any kind of discussion. Q. Mr. Rakishev, are you aware of any evidence that Mr. Ilyas Khrapunov is responsible for hacking emails that appeared on the Kazaword website?
MR. SCHWARTZ: Objection. He answered that twice now.
MR. CURLEY: He hasn't answered it any time, that's the point.
A. I believe I have answered this question. It's not my technical expertise. How can I tell you whether it is so or whether it's yes or no? How can I evaluate whether it is in evidence or it's not in evidence?
Q. Has anyone ever told you that they suspect Mr. Ilyas Khrapunov is responsible for hacking emails that appeared on the Kazaword website?
MR. SCHWARTZ: Objection, and to the extent that this involves any lawyer conversations, don't answer it.
Q. Let me withdraw that.
A. I will abide by my lawyer's instructions.
Q. Other than any conversations you may have had with BTA's lawyers, has anyone never told you that they suspect Mr. Ilyas Khrapunov is responsible for hacking emails that appeared on the Kazaword website?
MR. SCHWARTZ: Objection.
A. I never, ever met any expert in technical - in IT who would be able to affirm that this is true or not true.
Q. Do you know, as chairman of the board of directors of BTA Bank, whether BTA Bank has any evidence that Mr. Ilyas Khrapunov was responsible for hacking the emails that appeared on the Kazaword website?
MR. SCHWARTZ: Objection.
A. I believe I'm being asked the same question three or four times over and over again and I believe I responded to that that I do not have any technical expertise and I never had any meetings with any experts in IT who would affirm that or confirm that, so I believe that's the third or fourth time we are discussing that and, actually, this is an issue that lawyers could comment on.
Q. Mr. Rakishev, I'm not asking for evidence that may be limited to technical expertise. I'm talking about any evidence at all whether technical or nontechnical. Are you aware whether BTA has any evidence at all, technical or not technical, that Mr. Ilyas Khrapunov is responsible for hacking the emails that appeared on a Kazaword website?
MR. SCHWARTZ: Objection.
A. I'm very respectful of your time and my time, I value it. And it is my understanding that this time is limited in the amount of time that was spent here cannot be more than it was prescribed and maybe we take it into consideration and specifically the fact that our lawyers have already objected to the question. Maybe we want to go over and over it again. I believe that I answered it to the extent that I could answer it and maybe we can move on.
Q. Maybe we can, Mr. Rakishev. You testified that you've answered the question, to the extent of your ability, right?
A. Yes, that's correct. I do not have technical expertise in order to tell you this is right or this is wrong.
Source: www.rucriminal.com
